00:27:12 <frg_Away> That is why I took the sledgehammer and ported the library.
02:41:31 <nsITobin> i mean I can't fault your logic it isn't like PART of Borealis didn't get refreshed from Pale Moon code same as SeaMonkey getting refreshed from Firefox code..
02:41:38 <nsITobin> rest well frg
03:00:06 <tomman> https://nitter.poast.org/deno_land/status/1876728474666217739 haha Orrible
03:00:12 <tomman> I HOPE that Orrible® starts asserting their JavaScript™ trademarks with their legendary packs of angry lawyers
03:00:22 <tomman> sure, it would destroy the Chromeist webdev community overnight... and that will be AWESOME~!
03:00:58 <nsITobin> How does oracle own JavaScript.. by all rights that SHOULD be owned by Verizon
03:01:01 <tomman> Of course it would also destroy software as we know it, as Orrible would try to assert copyright over every language ever, but hey, don't spoil my fun :D
03:01:04 <nsITobin> tomman:
03:01:09 <tomman> wat
03:01:13 <tomman> why Verizon?
03:01:14 <nsITobin> because version owns all netscape trademarks
03:01:25 <tomman> oh, I thought Microsoft now owned them
03:01:27 <nsITobin> and netscape .. specifically eich created javascript
03:01:38 <tomman> or was it Facebook?
03:01:40 <nsITobin> so how did oracle get it
03:01:45 <tomman> the trademarks have been resold so many times...
03:02:01 <tomman> the JS one they got it via Sun, which was the one that actually trademarked it
03:02:19 <nsITobin> how does sun own Javascript
03:02:24 <nsITobin> java != javascript
03:03:42 <nsITobin> https://tsdr.uspto.gov/#caseNumber=75026640&caseSearchType=US_APPLICATION&caseType=DEFAULT&searchType=statusSearch
03:03:45 <nsITobin> Well.. shit
03:06:27 <tomman> https://www.jwz.org/blog/2019/03/brand-necrophilia-part-7/ hmmm, you're right - Meta now owns the remnants of what was the Netscape corporation, except that the trademarks stayed at AOL
03:07:08 <tomman> but how we went from AOL to Verizon? IIRC what went to Verizon was Yahoo aka Oath
03:09:09 <tomman> wtf, because Verizon DID acquired AOL in 2015, D'OH!
03:10:02 <nsITobin> i can't find any record of a trademark registered for gecko
03:10:05 <tomman> and then they also acquired Yahoo, and that's where Oath merged
03:10:07 <nsITobin> or a dead one
03:10:12 <tomman> --came to be, by the merger of AOL and Yahoo
03:10:24 <tomman> ...but even then Oath is not anymore a Verizon biz
03:10:26 <tomman> > On May 3, 2021, Verizon announced it would sell 90 percent of its Verizon Media division to Apollo Global Management for $5 billion. The division became the second incarnation of Yahoo! Inc.[7]
03:11:02 <nsITobin> the netscape trademarks are owned by an AOL Services llc or something to that effect
03:11:10 <tomman> ...OK, they still own a 10%, but the other 90% is some Wall Street capital management vultures
03:11:21 <nsITobin> AOL MEMBERSHIP SERVICES LLC (LIMITED LIABILITY COMPANY; DELAWARE, USA)
03:11:39 <tomman> so technically The New Yahoo owns AOL everything, which also includes the NSCP trademarks
03:12:38 <tomman> and the New Yahoo is "90% Apollo, 10% Verizon", built over the ashes of AOL and the original Yahoo and some Western Electric phones
03:13:00 <tomman> why USAian business have to be that convoluted!?
03:14:13 <tomman> Aside: there is still a small bit of the original Yahoo still surviving: Yahoo Japan
03:14:25 <nsITobin> what happened to communism being the threat
03:14:30 <nsITobin> tell me THAT
03:14:40 <nsITobin> it suddenly isn't anymore
03:14:48 <tomman> ...well, shit - even Y! Japan is no more
03:14:50 <tomman> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LY_Corporation
03:15:03 <nsITobin> oh hell
03:15:06 <tomman> it's now LINE
03:15:39 <Harzilein> oh
03:15:41 <Harzilein> interesting
03:15:43 <tomman> so for all practical purposes, Yahoo finally died in 2023
03:15:45 <nsITobin> tomman: its all gone or corrupt.. time to wash it all way and rebuild it all
03:16:12 <tomman> wear gloves
03:16:34 <nsITobin> so remember my old mantra .. Pale Moon is not Firefox and never will be again?
03:16:53 <nsITobin> day and a half to make it Firefox 2/3ish
03:16:54 <tomman> reminds me of a meme at the long defunct Spanish version of Slashdot
03:17:03 <nsITobin> on a source level
03:17:09 <nsITobin> i was full..
03:17:12 <nsITobin> of shit
03:17:16 <Harzilein> tomman: running actual slashcode?
03:17:23 <tomman> "Barrapunto ya no es lo que era pero aun usa Debian" ("Spanish Slashdot is not what it used to be but still runs Debian"
03:17:32 <tomman> Harzilein: and a very VERY outdated version
03:17:39 <Harzilein> what was the name of that other more edgy slashcode instance...
03:17:44 <tomman> the site finally bite the dust before the pandemic
03:17:50 <Harzilein> kuro5hin, right
03:18:22 <Harzilein> was _that_ a slashcode instance?
03:18:36 <Harzilein> barrapunto, nice :)
03:30:39 <tomman> yeah, it was mostly Spainards, tho
03:30:47 <tomman> and the local trolls really disliked Latin Americans posting there
03:31:08 <tomman> it was nowhere near of the cesspool that Slashdot became, but at times Barrapunto was an awkward place to be if you weren't from Spain
03:31:32 <tomman> (But then Slashdot is mostly USA anyway)
03:32:03 <tomman> Anyway, readership steeply declined in the early '10s, and so did contributors too
03:32:39 <tomman> at it worst point, it had one new post every month or so, instead of several times a day, and journals were largely abandoned too
03:32:58 <tomman> it finally died a silent death sometime before the pandemic
13:18:07 <njsg> I guess github is now hiding comments and activity in issues behind javascript?
13:18:19 <njsg> or maybe it's one of their transient issues and will be gone in a few hours...
13:50:19 <nsITobin> moo
14:22:13 <frg_Away> buh
14:41:10 <nsITobin> I think Windows Update has killed my NTLite'd LTSC 2019 its in an update install loop and I can do nothing
14:41:39 <nsITobin> i mean even in the early days of nlite this was always possible but dang I sure had a good stretch of good luck doing it
15:47:00 <therube> thank you :-)
16:10:39 <njsg> nsITobin: are you sure it does not have crowdstrike software? :-P
16:31:04 <tomman> 2025 and ClownStrike is still a thing, wow
16:31:09 <tomman> the market works, it seems
16:47:36 <nsITobin> njsg: i am pretty sure the update is in a failed loop because its trying to service something I removed and unlike MOST times it no longer is happy about it.. I have had this happen back in the XP days but of course XP either booted or it bluescreened.. windows 10.. can do lots more .. none of it useful like keep trying and failing to install the same update never allowing me to login
16:48:41 <nsITobin> CrowdStrike: We Stop Breaches with AI-native Cybersecurity
16:48:51 <nsITobin> AI .. IS a threat to Cybersecurity
16:49:48 <njsg> the most I've seen has been NT 7.1 taking ages to install updates that would fail
16:50:00 <njsg> it seems sometimes this is because Windows Update lacks dependency management
16:50:25 <nsITobin> njsg: nt kernel versions became meaningless with Windows 7
16:51:21 <tomman> I went to get some cash to that bank branch I visit say, 2, maybe 3 times  a year
16:51:26 <tomman> they're still using XP and IE8
16:51:31 <tomman> HOW
16:51:32 <tomman> WHY
16:51:44 <tomman> do they even get an audit!?
16:52:00 <tomman> XP, IE8, and the theme service improperly disabled
16:52:25 <nsITobin> well its properly disabled they just didn't set the gdi metrics and colors back
16:53:04 <nsITobin> once UXTheme engages it will adjust the GDI metrics to accomidate the skin
16:54:47 <tomman> they're still using Office 2007 for no good reason at all too
16:55:06 <tomman> I doubt MS is taking money from anyone these days to keep XP-era software alive for life
16:55:20 <tomman> and yet... this smallish Venezuelan bank defies all logic
16:58:05 <njsg> nsITobin: how else do I say "Windows 7 and Windows 2008R2"?
17:24:08 <nsITobin> njsg: Good Windows
17:24:11 <nsITobin> LOL
17:25:03 <nsITobin> tho win2k is Great Windows
17:25:04 <guest> Ctrl+C Ctrl+V works in latest FireFox the same as in previous version of SM 2.53.19 or earlier, e.g. duplicating a separator (or bookmark) works with CtrlC and CtrlV without moving the selection
17:25:06 <njsg> Windows 98 and NT 5.0 are offended :-P
17:26:21 <nsITobin> guest: An effort in the SeaMonkey Project has been to refresh the Places/Library (History and Bookmarks) code at least up to the point that Firefox started crippling features of it.. So some behavior changes and minor bugs are to be expected.
17:27:17 <guest> as written: in FireFox copy+paste is working but not in SM 2.53.20. The question is is this intended or a regression bug ?
17:27:54 <njsg> this was were, bookmark/library window?
17:28:07 <nsITobin> guest: window or sidebar
17:29:00 <nsITobin> guest: https://logbot.thereisonlyxul.org/seamonkey/20250107#c14149-c14151 from last night
17:29:06 <nsITobin> does that answer anything?
17:29:07 <guest> Bookmarks side bar and Bookmarks Library Manager
17:29:48 <frg_Away> I will take a look when I continue with the places porting
17:30:05 <njsg> I, uh...
17:30:08 <guest> it give a workaround but it does not explain whether a bug or by a design.
17:30:14 * njsg blinks
17:30:27 <njsg> I tried, it didn't paste, I used the context menu, it pasted, now c+v pastes too
17:30:30 <guest> frg_Away : thank
17:30:49 <guest> could you  reproduce it ?
17:30:55 <nsITobin> for everyone present.. Places == Library == History and Bookmarks (and kinda sorda but not really Downloads)
17:31:10 * njsg says debugging gets harder if you can't even establish clearly whether the version you're testing on is affected or not
17:31:13 <guest> nsgj: likely because the selection changed
17:32:00 <frg_Away> Code is in the middle of 60 currently. 2.53.20 fixes a few other obscure copy and paste bugs but still needs some updates.
17:32:17 <njsg> guest: if the copied separator is selected, I can't paste, if a pasted selector is selected, I can paste more of them
17:32:47 <guest> njsg: that's exactly what I've described.
17:35:22 <guest> frg_Away: is it likely that in one of the next few versions of SM the sites are working better - e.g. live.com (web based microsoft mail) or https://www.msn.com ?
17:43:40 <frg_Away> I need to finsh the js update then it will. No eta
22:12:36 <tonymec|away> «The operation timed out when attempting to contact www. wg9s .com : The requested site did not respond to a connection request and the browser has stopped waiting for a reply.»
22:15:30 <nsITobin> tonymec|away: https://i.ibb.co/4dgQjzm/image.png
22:16:58 <frg_Away> tried to contact him via mail but didn't get a reply yes. Was a severe storm in the area so lines might be out. Will see that i dig out his phone number.
22:17:15 <frg_Away> ^reply yet
22:18:20 <nsITobin> i hope he is ok
22:18:42 <tonymec|away> nsITobin: yeah, my traceroute also stops at 100.41.x.x